That was a scary night
By - Ocean_Beast
Depending on the state, you can have up to 50 pounds of black powder in your house without having to get a permit. That would be lots more messy than loose ammo.
Yep, we had a guy in my city that had all sort of black powder and reloading stuff and tons of ammo. He also built his own fireworks and had stuff for doing that.
His small house exploded. Nothing left but a pile of rubble spread around a 100ft circle. Killed instantly.
That is a both tragic and the realest
Loose ammo can be very dangerous in itself although a stash won't go off all at once in such a scenario and without the barrel to give bullets time to get propelled by expanding gas across a distance larger than the length of a shell, they can be less lethal at longer distances (although still injurious). But a full 50 pounds of black powder in a single place or even a minute fraction of that laying around in your house in an unprotected place is an absolute recipe for disaster. Black powder is actually one of the slower burning pyrotechnic mixtures out there, but it produces large amounts of gas and in a confined space like a tightly closed plastic container, it can cause major damage in such quantities. Even if it's a slower burning composite like a slow smokeless powder, it can very easily burn down a room in a very short period of time in those quantities because of how violently it combusts. Be careful and responsible with your firearms y'all. They can be a matter of life or death and you need to be very aware of risks associated with them.
Sounds like a lot more than 50 pounds lol
Might not be the same story, but this stuff has happened [before. ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benton_fireworks_disaster)
Black powder burns violently when not enclosed, does it not? Likely that the house still burns to cinders before the FD gets there, but not explosively sending house fragments into the neighborhood
Uhh... 50 lbs of black powder would go off like a bomb. Like "a powder keg", if you will.
Here is less than 1/4lb
That's 1000g, so 2lbs 3oz.
Still, 20 times that in your house.
Thanks. My brain ain't functioning today. For some reason my brain dropped the last 0 on that, and I only read 100g...
>When not enclosed
*links video of very enclosed black powder*
Who is going to store black powder in a pile in their house? It's definitely going to be in some kind of container
It typically comes in thin plastic jars with about 2 pounds of powder in it. It isn't durable enough to build up much pressure.
"it's a complete mystery how the fire started, but thank god they left their black powder in loose piles all over the home instead of inside a container!"
besides the fact that no one would just have a loose pile of black powder, the original comment this is about specifically said the guy made his own fireworks with it.
i dont know what thread you are reading, but no one I responded to, or anyone above them said anything about fireworks. Top comment just said its legal to have 50 lbs, then someone said that would burn slow and hot if it wasnt contained, and then the guy I responded to said no it would explode, and showed contained black powder.
That's not. Afire cracker that's a pipe bomb :o
that's a pipebomb you posted
I keep mine in a .50 cal ammo can. If my house went up, the heat would eventually ignite it and since ammo cans are sealed... well it wouldn't be nice. I would say most people keep theirs in such containers because there's not really any way a spark or moisture can get to them. When a house burns down, all bets are off.
Who the hell even uses black powder? Much less 50 pounds?
There are specific hunting seasons for it. Also, antique firearm collectors and reenactors.
Probably a good indication of why laws & constitutions should be updated over time.
No, I mean the only people who use black powder are very niche enthusiasts who probably know what they're doing. There isn't really much point to restricting people from having any amount of black powder at all. Most enthusiasts likely wouldn't have much more than 20 pounds.
There isn’t much of a reason? It’s practically dynamite, that’s a very good reason why individuals should be limited.
It’s not “practically dynamite”, it’s not even explosive unless it’s compressed in a container or in a secure enough position for it to build up pressure (I.e., the barrel of a gun or a homemade bomb). if you were storing it in cardboard it would burn up. If it was in plastic bags it would burn. If it was in a lead pipe capped off with a fuse in one end, it would fucking explode because that’s a pipe bomb.
Side note- I was looking up bomb shit when I wrote this so I’m probably on a list now. Also you can learn how to make a [pipe bomb](https://youtu.be/cOe6HPJUGLg) on YouTube for some reason 💀
That’s wrong. Black powder is an explosive, regardless of it being in a container or not. It’s not a high explosive though, so it doesn’t create a shockwave like dynamite would.
What you’re describing is true for smokeless gunpowder, not for black powder.
Blackpowder is significantly weaker than dynamite. There's a reason it was dropped from use in pretty much all mainstream uses of explosives, especially in comparison to dynamite.
Yeah I'm fine with it being restricted past 50 pounds. It's restrictions on having any amount of black powder that I have an issue with. 2 pounds in a thin plastic jar isn't very explosive and no one's keeping it in big metal drums. If black powder is ignited out in the open or in an easily broken container, it's mainly going to burn, not explode. Also there's a difference between black powder and smokeless powder in case you didn't know.
It's definitely not dynamite. Dynamite is a high order explosive, black powder is low order. The difference is that powder burns and is only explosive when it's contained and high order explosives explode without containment. The pressure difference is pretty significant.
I use black powder. Muskets and shit are fun as fuck.
It's also legal to own blackpowder cannons so when each charge is say a half pound, you can go through a lot.
My honey was a volunteer firefighter in small town Alaska. Went to an interior house fire. Owner failed to tell them that he had fire arms. They went in and one guy fell through the floor into the basement armory! An armory that was filled with actual barrels of gunpowder because the dude reloaded his own shells. They used the biggest hose they had and filled his basement with water. The dude tried to whine that they ruined all his gear.... you let us walk into a fucking bomb! Fuck that dude.
Seriously fuck that guy. Glad your fam is ok
Omg I was so nervous that was going to end badly. Holy crap that must have been so scary!
I bet they didn’t even try to shoot the fire.
Fuckin socialist, amiright?!
The only way to stop a bad fire with a gun is a good gun with a fire.
so a flamethrower?
I'm unclear on what it means but there *is* something called friendly fire.
However, there is a risk of fragments from the pop-corning casing, etc. and I know a coworker who was injured when an ejecting hot shell casing freakishly landed on his pistol ammo and set off a free round - stitches as a reminder to load your magazines before standing on the line.
> I know a coworker who was injured when an ejecting hot shell casing freakishly landed on his pistol ammo and set off a free round
complete bullshit. Your coworker wasn't telling you the truth; it sounds like he shot himself by accident and couldn't admit that he was an idiot.
A hot shell casing doesn't contain enough thermal energy to set off a primer. If it did, then bullets would fire the moment they were chambered - the inside of a firearm chamber and the bolt face quickly reach hundreds of degrees in temperature during moderate shooting.
They also don't have enough kinetic energy to set off a primer. If that was possible, then bullets would go off from being dropped on the ground - but they don't.
Absolutely right, there are huge pieces of that dudes story missing. Modern bullets are insanely resilient
If you dropped it and the primer perfectly hit a pointy rock I believe it would go off. Maybe it's not possible but this seems plausible. Would make a good Mythbusters.
Stop lying. It takes significantly more heat than is carried in a spent casing to set off a round. You can eject a spent casing into a pile of gunpowder and it wouldn't even set it off.
Your coworker lied to you.
Always certainly possible, however I saw photos of both the ruptured case and I saw the stitches -- to clarify in my first post, I didn't say he was struck by a bullet. However, somehow his hot empty ejected onto a round he had with him at the firing line. Somehow that caused the round to rupture and he was hit with a piece of metal from the brass case. For some reason, this seems to be causing folks mental distress -- which wasn't my intent. Gun safety is important, and whether you believe this story or not, or whether or not I'm a big liar, be safe. And that's not an anti gun statement, since I've had just as much fun as anyone plinking away.
I don’t doubt your coworker did something stupid and got hurt, but an ejected case can not, under any circumstances short of being heated close to melting, transfer enough energy to detonate a cartridge ammunition primer. Not by heat transfer or by impact. It’s a physical impossibility.
Your irrational fears notwithstanding, it takes an enormous act of idiocy to “accidentally” detonate modern ammunition.
Well good -- thank you for putting my irrational fears to rest -- I'll go tell my coworker that he is both a liar and and idiot, since it is simply impossible for this event to have occurred.
Let us know what he says about that
This happened to my cousin. It wasnt from lightining tho. They left a plastic tub of dog treats on top of their stove. Dog jumped up and accidently set their place on fire. Eventually it got bad enough that the ammunition went off. No one was hurt (except the animals who died except for 2 cats). The lived in Alaska so no real neighbors so when they came home, it was nearly impossible to save anything.
I've had to scold my parents a couple times for leaving stuff like dog food on their stove. Literally anywhere else to put it and they kept picking stove. Stove can be on for hours no problem. It's whatever is on top that catches fire. I tell them keep the stove top clear
She learned her lesson the hard way, unfortunately. She lost her home and her animals (except for one who was an outside cat)
There was an old guy on my street when I was a kid whose house caught on fire, but he wouldn't let the firemen onto the property and threatened to shoot them with his rifle if they got close. I'm not sure how it ended, but I think the house ended up getting demolished.
Sounds like he might have been mentally ill :( Or he could have intentionally started the fire as some sort of insurance scam, idk
In the end his ammo did protect his house...just happened to protect it from the FD and at the wrong time.
Like most gun nuts, the guy probably howled about socialism. Yet he just ASSUMED that the fire department would show up at his house immediately without any regard to where he lived or any expectation of being paid.
His stockpile saved him from socialism, aka the publicly funded fire department.
Probably won't stay socialist for long in the US. Private firefighters are already a thing
Yes, rich people always have access to more resources. This doesn't change the demand/need for public/"free" firefighting in the United States.
Congratulations you got angry at something you just made up
Stockpiles also make your home robbery targets because most people who have them will sure let you know. They are so afraid of the rare chance of a robbery (especially in small towns where they live) but they end up putting a huge sign saying "things of value inside please come in because I work sometimes".
PSA: the same applies with cars.
Got a big NRA sticker and a don't tread on me flag? Car raiders are going for your glove box first.
No step on snek.
Most people have a locking cabinet at the minimum or a fireproof safe because…guns are fucking expensive.
Yeah, but lots of safes can just be picked up.
I think that’s the funniest thing ever on cctv. Watching some mad lad just haul the safe off.
I went to the shooting range today. Cant believe there is still such an "ammo shortage" that they could only sell me one box of 50 rounds.
Its kind of satisfying to hear that one of these ammo hoarders is getting some bad karma. The guy probably had a pickup bed filled with gasoline and a basement full of toilet paper.
Nobody wants to fight for the 2nd ammendment for protection. People only care about having glorious amounts of guns and ammo to feel like a badass and have an excuse to kill someone when they're "threatened," which includes getting cut off on the highway. This country is a joke.
I'm super duper liberal but I have a gun for protection. You just wouldn't know I exist because I don't bring up my gun ownership unless I'm prompted, either by being asked or by someone else talking about the guns they own.
It's actually specifically for protecting myself and the people I care about *from* the kind of people you're talking about. I don't have any boner for killing, I just know that if they get to be in charge and they start going after my gay/trans/black/brown friends, a 12 gauge steel barbell slug through their ceramic armor will stop them from atrocities that words won't do much to prevent.
Take my up vote, you beautiful human being.
Or ya know... for hunting or going to the range and shooting for fun... not every gun owner is a macho asshole, they’re just often the loudest.
It's always the jacko wackos that are the loudest.
I feel you, I just don't think you need THAT much ammo (as mentioned in the post). Where I live, hunting deer is ESSENTIAL because we killed off/scared away all of the wolves. Target practice is a legitimate hobby and skill, although some ranges do need to tighten their rules for safety. I think it's also someone's right to protect their home or their life from attack, you just don't need military-grade weapons to do so.
What kinda bothered me was the guy that said, "Oh, I keep my gun on the top of the bookcase where the kids can't get to it."
Ooof that's not safe
That how it goes with most groups, unfortunately. The jackasses take up all the attention and so most assume the people talking loudest are representative of the group.
My votes are expressly for keeping it for protection.
I have two rifles, a shotgun, and a .22. I don’t want any more firearms, I have what I want. I’ve read enough history to know that the right to defend yourself is one of the most important rights a person should have. 150 million dead civilians over the last 150 years would probably agree.
Or, get this, the second amendment is about protection from tyranny and self defense
Good luck protecting yourself from the most heavily funded military in the world, assuming so "tyranny" happens (as if our current system isn't already tyrannical to those impoverished). Self defense, I can get behind that... but you don't need more than a pistol with one magazine for that one rare case someone breaks into your home while you're not out working.
Reminds me of a small town around here that voted to disband their public fire department in favor of a subscription based fire district. This lead to layoffs, plus the firefighters were no longer eligible for a state pension.
So one prominent supporter of the disband vote decided not to subscribe, yet soon after his house mysteriously catches on fire. The FD shows up but instead of putting out his house they protect his neighbors. As he’s begging the chief to save his home the chief, who knows him by name says “Bill, open enrollment ended a few weeks ago. If you’d like to subscribe next January we’ll come back and work on this little blaze.”
I remember reading about that. Was it TN?
When the fire fights back
Noted, keep the ammo in the storm shelter. It’s underground and surrounded by concrete.
Why did he have so many bullets? A few hours is a crazy long time for gunpowder to be going off. Was he prepping for a zombie apocalypse or something?
Some people buy in bulk. Also if you do any sport shooting it's easy to go through a lot of ammo. An afternoon of shooting clay pigeons can easily be 100 shotgun shells per person.
“The fire is shooting at us!”
Its not really all that ironic, seeing they most likely had all of those bullets so that they could have some fun at the gun range. Once you get past one ammo box, it has little to nothing to do with protection and much more to do with an expensive hobby.
it is also, of course, entirely lacking any political humor in the first place
Americans are weird. You need maybe six bullets and one gun for home defence. For a civil war, you need a supply chain. Stockpiling doesn't make sense.
You need at least a standard capacity 30 round mag and a rifle for home defense. Maybe 17 rounds if you have a handgun like a Glock 17. 6 rounds ain't gonna cut it
And the reason most people have a lot of ammo is to train and for range time.
People complain about gun owners not being trained, but complain when gun owners buy bulk ammo to train with
Pretty sure that isn't the type of training they meant.....
Training with a gun means shooting it often
People who shoot often need a bunch of ammo so they don't wind up not having any for the next time they go shooting
When we're talking about training we're generally talking about the good guy with a gun narrative. The average gun owner is not trained to deal with an emergency situation nor are they trained to know when it is appropriate to use force.
Well there are up to 2.5 million cases of defensive gun uses in the United States each year, according to the CDC
It's clear that without training we still have a shit ton of DGUs
Yeah 6 bullets, sure man
Define "enormous stockpile".
Also, bullets are harmless and inert.
Edit: Since I'm being modded down, no doubt by people who are ignorant, I will explain. A "bullet" is the part that flies out of the firearm. It is nothing more than a shaped piece of metal. A "cartridge" is a bullet, casing, powder, and primer. I'll accept "round" as a correct answer, too.
If you have a big pile of bullets and apply fire, you'll heat up some metal, but nothing more. If you have a big pile of cartridges and you apply heat, you can cause them to "pop" off. However, they bullet portion will not go flying off dangerously. The energy is not contained and directed as in the chamber of a gun. However, there is a chance of metal fragments from the casing to cause injury, but it's not going to be anything like what you see in bad action movies.
That's just not how bullets and bullet casings work.
In order for a bullet to be launched from a rifle, you need the barrel of the gun directing the force.
If the heat causes a cartridge to go off, it will just puncture the brass case and cause a popping noise. The actual bullet itself will probably not even separate from the brass.
House fires are so loud that you probably would not even hear the bullets popping off.
Probably not the same incident as the one in OP, but here is[ news story](https://www.firerescue1.com/firefighter-safety/articles/5k-rounds-of-ammunition-explode-at-calif-house-fire-Mj4Zx3oc71CBbleX/) about the same thing, fire fighters refused to enter.
Yeah just because it's "safe" doesn't mean that a person that doesn't know shit about how that stuff actually works is going to take on what they see as a perceived and unnecessary risk to their own safety especially if they're hearing multiple micro explosions every few seconds/minutes.
Still wouldn’t be safe for the FD to enter the house
You ever throw a bunch of bullets in a fire. I can tell you for certain the bullet will pop and can hurt anyone in the area.
No it won't. Bullets need an enclosed area to use pressure to exert itself rapidly from the brass. Obviously you wouldn't want to be putting your face right up to it, but it's not going to fly out and kill you from a safe distance
2:00 or so in
So did your renter's insurance come through?
Nah this is just stuff I know cause I strenuously research everything and I was looking up leaving guns in hot cars and went down a rabbit hole.
Wait is that dangerous?
Yes, storing ammunition is kinda like storing batteries: avoid hot/humid conditions, as they can ruin rounds
You just saved someone from a whoopsie, lol. This is also why I stopped storing old shotgun shells under my bed in my uninsulated top-floor bedroom.
It isn't going to go off from that. It probably needs to be at least 200 degrees to even be at risk of firing.
You're probably right that I'm being irrational, but these are 20 year old hand loads from a dead uncle that I use to practice shooting with unreliable ammo that might not always cycle...I just don't trust them in general, but what they lack in trustworthiness is made up for in usefulness as a training tool. Also the bedroom is above the kitchen, so I don't want a late night kitchen fire to shoot me in my sleep before I even have a chance to bail.
I doubt the powder becomes more volatile with time. If anything it might be less likely to ignite. Also, you should look up a video of a shell going off outside of a shotgun. Basically, if a round isn't in a chamber, the casing ruptures and the pressure of the explosion primarily goes out in all directions. The pellets most likely won't have enough force behind them to fully penetrate the mattress.
Edit: And if you're still worried, just store it pellet side down.
It would suck for the firefighters. Like standing next to popcorn made of brass and lead. But highly unlikely to injure them.
Factual post is factual. Loose rounds are safe in fires, even if they go off. Lots of YouTube videos that show it.
Not sure why you’re being down voted… I guess the real danger would be from any chambered rounds they may have…
Or just the sheer volume of bullets. A couple hundred rounds might be no biggie, but people have been panic hoarding. If it was enough bullets to go off all night, this guy might have had tens or hundreds of thousands of rounds. That shit is way more common than you would think.
What I mean is nothing he said is wrong. The guy stated a few facts. He didn’t say the FD should enter, he just said that’s not how bullets and bullet casing work and then described how they do. And basically got downvoted for being informative.
**TLDR: He got downvoted because he's wrong. If rounds exposed to fire were harmless, they wouldn't call the fucking bomb squad in if they find them in the aftermath of a house fire.**
Strictly speaking, he got downvoted for claiming you wouldn't hear the rounds going off, and for claiming they're not dangerous in a fire.
Both of those things are bullshit. You will definitely hear hunting caliber rounds or shotgun shells in a house fire, and a bullet is a fucking bullet...if there are loaded guns in the house, they will kill you if they discharge due to heat exposure and you're where they are pointing. Guns are where bullets are usually. Loaded guns are often where guns are.
Also, the whole "they discharge harmlessly" is not at all guaranteed. Any casing has the potential to *not* fail, which will result in the bullet discharging with less force, but in more or less the same way it would if fired from the barrel of a gun.
He got downvoted because it's kind of just common sense that, even if a cartridge doesn't *generally* discharge lethally in a house fire, it is still a cartridge. It's still a thing you should handle carefully that has the potential to kill or seriously harm you. It doesn't suddenly become a thing less worthy of your caution and respect because it's on fire.
No, no. You should own as many guns as you can because one day you have to fight the tanks and missiles of a tyrannical government. Don't take any chances.
We had a tyrannical government try to take over earlier this year. It seemed all the 2As were juss fine wit dat. As long as the tyranny was mah man! TRUMP!
Not all of them. Some of them watched that happen while they practiced trigger drills and prayed this wouldn't mean putting down our trumper relatives. :P
I don't have firearms to shoot tanks. I'm building a moat for them.
Well, long as there's a plan
After my first batch of armored pterodactyls are bread I will be the largest threat to our government since the invention of crunchy peanut butter.
Are we breeding them or breading them? With the peanut butter it could go either way.
Also, while you're commiting unholy genetic experimentation I want a T-Rex with tentacles, will solve the stubby arm vulnerability.
If you have a weapon capable of turning armored pterodactyls into bread, you can stop. You've reached superweapon status.
The key is to turn them to bread and then... Are you ready for this? Put the crunchy peanut butter on the armored pterodactyl bread... That's how you get decepticons.
If you don't have a howitzer, do you even understand the Constitution?
Typically you wouldn't have to fight off a home invader for hours on end...
Have you even seen all the terminators? Don't come crying to me when the T2000 is ripping your legs off and your rape whistle is clogged with all my shell casings.
Sounds like paranoia to me
Who said that...
Idiot doesn't store his ammo properly and gives honest, hardworking, safe gun nuts like me a bad name.
Yep, better not do anything about it then.
I mean if the fire is already cooking off rounds, the house is probably pretty well burnt already.
God damn ammo making lighting strike the house.
Do you how the insurance company handled it? Like it’s kind of his fault the fire couldn’t be put out… did insurance pay out?
Hi Mr. Smallhands, I'm your insurance agent. I've read the report and it says here that the fire department arrived in time but they let your house burn down because you thought you were setting up to fight WWIII. Tell us again how we should pay for your bad decision.
Rounds just sitting there are not dangerous. They can pop, but due to the lack of pressure from not being chambered, they are harmless.
There is no risk to fire fighters in proper gear (specifically eye protection). Unless there were reloading supplies or some other factor there would be no reason not to go in. There are plenty of YouTube videos demonstrating this including training for fire fighters. This is either a fabrication or missing some other important details.
A bullet loaded in the chamber of a gun will detonate and fire the projectile, same as if someone pulled the trigger.
Can confirm: "Wisconsin firefighter shot after weapon inside burning building discharges"
I think this post is about stock of ammunition, not about loaded gun.
Keep crying about gun rights liberals
They... Do though? It's so easy to look up that bullets can indeed have a mini explosion when tossed into a fire? And there is a link to a news story about fireman not going inside a house because of this exact story. Maybe do some research before calling bullocks?
I’d like a source on that. Without a barrel to focus the gasses given off by the explosion of a round, the bullet is largely harmless. You can watch people do this and the round won’t even go through a thin metal pan.
I assume if real that the hazard would be a really large amount of ammo exploding and adding fuel to the fire.
I don’t see why they would need to go into the house either, seems like it was going to burn either way. There is no reason they could not try to stop the fire from the outside
United Shitholes of America I guess, lol.
Anti gunners: people who own guns need to be trained
Gun Owner: *buys bulk ammo so they can train*
Anti gunners: oMg wHy dO tHeY hAvE a sToCkPiLe oF aMmO. sMaLl dIcK wAnNaBe mAsS sHoOtEr